E85 oil contamination is a self inflicted wound.

[fumanchu182]

E85 oil contamination?

• Undersized catch can
• No catch can
• Pissing e85 in the cylinder

The above reasons may be at fault if you have experienced it. I have run e85 for two years now and not experienced this issue once on two motors. 2.70 and 10% lower, 22-24 psi. Also great science based article: https://lmengines.com/pages/the-truth-about-e-85-tech-information
@Unholy707 and @Speedy! I know you have commented on this before but figured I’d throw this out there.

 

[covidcommander]

Worry about these issues with e85 from a gas station. Funny but don't worry about them with 93 from the pump.

 

[Unholy707]

I wonder why my oil pressure is so low. Oddly it was higher when manual. No 40-50 at idle and 61-62 when driving

 

[Unholy707]

My oil is always thick and frothy. I run the same catch can but not vented and witch check valves. The issue is if you wash the cylinders needs and don’t get the car up to temp to burn off the e85 in the crank case

 

[Marc W]

Oil being contaminated by fuel is a result of it getting pushed past the rings and into the crankcase on the compression stroke. That cylinder has fuel being injected into it for combustion (obviously). Unburned fuel gets pushed past the rings. The higher the pressure (boost), the more it will happen. The better your ring seal, the less it will happen. My opinion on catch cans…. Real catch cans work. The small little things that are attached up close to the engine where they soak up and retain heat are ornamental. They don’t do shit. The catch can works by providing a large cooling surface for the hot oil and fuel vapors to condense and be converted back into liquid form so they remain in the can. For a can to do that it needs to be cool. That means it needs to be remotely placed so it can stay that way. It needs to have a large enough cooling surface (baffles) to condense a sufficient percentage of the vapor passing through/over them. It should be vented to the outside. Oil and fuel vapor being fed back into the intake to be mixed with the fresh air and fuel being used to make power isn’t doing anything good. Crankcase pressure in a boosted engine should be vented anyway, so this catch can is the best way to do it. My setup is 1.3 gallons. My engine is 5 years old now and needs rings. Boosting 25+ lbs and using a can that works shows you how much fuel is getting by those rings. I drained a quart of ethanol from my can after 10 passes. I’m sure that my fresh engine will be much better. What do you suppose one of those little guys would have done with this.

 

[TNREDEYE]

Well said Marc. I agree on all counts.
Although I do think your basic analysis more applies to more
of a "full race" type of setup than a street setup.
IMO a mid nine-ish street setup doesn't really benefit from one
at all, especially if it's the ornamental toy size ones you mentioned.

 

[Marc W]

Well said Marc. I agree on all counts.
Although I do think your basic analysis more applies to more
of a "full race" type of setup than a street setup.
IMO a mid nine-ish street setup doesn't really benefit from one
at all, especially if it's the ornamental toy size ones you mentioned.

I agree. A relatively stock engine that is healthy certainly isn’t going to suffer from not having one. I guess my point is…. for a catch can to be more than just a decoration, it needs to have the characteristics that I was pointing out. My engine has really just been a stroker street motor with 9.5 compression and an aggressively pulleyed 3.0 Whipple. It will be interesting to see what the really aggressive new motor with the turbos does. I’m looking at changing to a trunk placed 3 gallon can for safety reasons concerning potential engine damage that will push oil out.

 

[Unholy707]

Oil being contaminated by fuel is a result of it getting pushed past the rings and into the crankcase on the compression stroke. That cylinder has fuel being injected into it for combustion (obviously). Unburned fuel gets pushed past the rings. The higher the pressure (boost), the more it will happen. The better your ring seal, the less it will happen. My opinion on catch cans…. Real catch cans work. The small little things that are attached up close to the engine where they soak up and retain heat are ornamental. They don’t do shit. The catch can works by providing a large cooling surface for the hot oil and fuel vapors to condense and be converted back into liquid form so they remain in the can. For a can to do that it needs to be cool. That means it needs to be remotely placed so it can stay that way. It needs to have a large enough cooling surface (baffles) to condense a sufficient percentage of the vapor passing through/over them. It should be vented to the outside. Oil and fuel vapor being fed back into the intake to be mixed with the fresh air and fuel being used to make power isn’t doing anything good. Crankcase pressure in a boosted engine should be vented anyway, so this catch can is the best way to do it. My setup is 1.3 gallons. My engine is 5 years old now and needs rings. Boosting 25+ lbs and using a can that works shows you how much fuel is getting by those rings. I drained a quart of ethanol from my can after 10 passes. I’m sure that my fresh engine will be much better. What do you suppose one of those little guys would have done with this. View attachment 140367 View attachment 140368

100% agree. I need to close the gap on my plugs, I’ll be doing that soon. I’m sure the condensation from living in a hot humid climate with a chiller isn’t doing me any good either

 

[TNREDEYE]

I’m looking at changing to a trunk placed 3 gallon can for safety reasons concerning potential engine damage that will push oil out.

You won't regret that. I would suggest making sure that your tank vent goes outside of the car.

 

[Marc W]

You won't regret that. I would suggest making sure that your tank vent goes outside of the car.

Many if not most high power cars are going to what in other circles is called the burn down tank. It vents to the outside behind the car. Usually through the deck lid. The reason is these motors have the potential to suffer a catastrophic failure that pressurizes the crankcase and they can expel gallons of oil. You don’t want that happing in front of the rear tires. I’m looking at building this into the new structure in the rear of the car. I saw that Colby just did his.

 

[fumanchu182]

Well said Marc. I agree on all counts.
Although I do think your basic analysis more applies to more
of a "full race" type of setup than a street setup.
IMO a mid nine-ish street setup doesn't really benefit from one
at all, especially if it's the ornamental toy size ones you mentioned.

I don't agree with this at all. I'm a mid nine-ish car on a bad day. This is what is caught.

A proper catch can on a Hellcat goes a long long long way especially when driven.

100% agree. I need to close the gap on my plugs, I’ll be doing that soon. I’m sure the condensation from living in a hot humid climate with a chiller isn’t doing me any good either

10 minutes before home turn the chiller off and let that moisture burn off.

 

[Unholy707]

I don't agree with this at all. I'm a mid nine-ish car on a bad day. This is what is caught.
View attachment 140374
A proper catch can on a Hellcat goes a long long long way especially when driven.
View attachment 140375

10 minutes before home turn the chiller off and let that moisture burn off.

Yep, that’s exactly what I’ve been doing and letting it flow through the heat exhanger and getting up to at least 70 degrees before turning it off

 

[Unholy707]

My chiller is “always on” with AC, so I just flip the heat exhanger button (usually too hot to not have AC this time of year) and let it heat up

 

[BULL]

Mine catches "some", but clearly not "all" based on my intake.

.02

 

[RGPIII]

There is a huge difference between the 899 and 041 filters. Just something to think about.

 

[fumanchu182]

There is a huge difference between the 899 and 041 filters. Just something to think about.

I don't see anything different in the filters other than price and pressure flow. SRT engineers designed this filter for the Viper not the Hellcat. The Hellcat oil pump is vastly different than a viper one. Just so someone can draw their own conclusions:

Factory service manual:


Have your car at a dealership, you're getting an 899 filter.

 

[Marc W]

I don't see anything different in the filters other than price and pressure flow. SRT engineers designed this filter for the Viper not the Hellcat. The Hellcat oil pump is vastly different than a viper one. Just so someone can draw their own conclusions:

Factory service manual:
View attachment 140403

Have your car at a dealership, you're getting an 899 filter.

Mine… 😑

 

[jroyk]

After buying a couple of 041's with center tube louvers that were barely open or even closed, I went back to the 899 which has holes. Also, micron ratings alone are meaningless. They have to be stated along with the efficiency rating to be meaningful.

 

[hellno]

WHEN I WAS RUNNING MY CAT I CHANGED OIL EVERY WEEKEND I RACED AND I ALWAYS RAN THE SRT FILTERS AND WOULD CUT THEM OPEN /WITH THE STOCK ENGINE THERE WAS NEVER ANY METAL AT ALL ,YEA I SPENT ALOT OF MONEY ON OIL CHANGES BUT BECAUSE OF THE STRONG E85 SMELL IN THE OIL I DID IT TO PREVENT ANY ISSUES

 

[jroyk]

One more consideration. The 041 has a dome end bypass valve and the 899 has a base end bypass. When a dome end filter goes into bypass, the oil washes over the dirty side of the filter media.